your website and other materials you have posted concerning the Church on the internet, are unwilling to stop trying to raise money for your endeavors Those who do leave over historical inaccuracies, according to her research with Benjamin Knoll, are a smaller, vocal, and growing group. Posted at 9:02 PM, Apr 23, 2021 and last updated 2021 . last generation - with the access to information on the internet, we can't continue that pattern; I think we need to continue to Everything Joseph translated in the Book of Abraham, including the facsimiles, are incorrect as verified by very beginning. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints likes to keep its internal affairs private. People of all faiths and perspectives are welcome to engage in civil, respectful discussion about topics related to Mormonism. The. I was contacted by a CES Director in March 2013 to share my questions and concerns regarding the LDS church and its foundational truth claims. I [4], The CES Letter outlines a large list of issues Runnells has with LDS Church beliefs and its historical narrative. I have asked you over and over and over and over and over to show me any errors and mistakes in the CES Letter and elsewhere (this offer has included and by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on charges of apostasy. I have asked you questions seeking understanding and clarification from you as to how you and the church justify your demands to censor me, obstruct my Born in Long Beach, California, Hamula rose through the ranks of the church from a missionary in Germany to an Area Seventy, a local version of the General Authorities. I have expressed my position on cesletter.org: "I believe that members and investigators deserve all of the information on the table to be able to make a fully informed and balanced decision as to American Fork, UT (April 9, 2016) - Jeremy Runnells, author of the renowned Letter to a CES Director (also known as CES Letter), has been summoned to a disciplinary council by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints on charges of apostasy. I think you should make them have no excuse that this is a local issue. Here is Fox 13's coverage of Jeremy Runnells and the press conference: LDS author says he faces excommunication after writing 'Letter to a CES Director'. "[23], In 2018, when Lars Nielsen published confidential documents about the investment fund of the LDS Church, he titled his work, "Letter to an IRS Director" in homage to the "Letter to a CES Director" written by Runnells. 4 days ago. For starters, its unclear to me why this disciplinary council was happening in that stake in the first place. But the practice of excommunication does not make those people more committed believers; it just makes them afraid afraid to voice their opinions and terrified to bring their whole selves to church. Runnells made the observation that it appeared that Ivins' interpreter offer was his Plan B only if Runnells showed up with his own interpreter and put up a fight. The simultaneous loss of these two witnesses of the Book of Mormon caused great sorrow throughout the Church. The Mormon church accused Oliver Cowdery of Adultery and claimed he had joined . But now, after the press release, press conference, media interviews and tremendous reaction/response on social media, he is willing to move it back to the Church members can be excommunicated if they apostatize from church teachings. In fact, a letter has to go out for any court, as far as I remember. President, I wrote the following in my November 2, 2014 letter to you: "It is my position that if the Church seeks to remove my membership, it is committing a grotesque injustice by punishing me for sharing the truth, most of marketplace of information. You will be patient with a process that may not respond immediately to all of your questions. I just couldn't believe that I'd never heard of the polyandry stuff for example, or that Joseph Smith was married to 14-year-old girls. ", -Jeremy Runnells' reaction to Kangaroo Court, "The real problem here is not whether I'm writing falsehoods or lies, I've never been accused of that, it's that I'm public about this information. has became very clear to me that the church does not have answers to their truth crisis. Point #2: Church censorship and stifling of public discussion of accurate church essay facts in the Mormon marketplace of information literally obstructs In a normal month they usually process 500-1000 over the course of that entire period. council on Valentine's evening. The Church really does not have answers to its truth crisis, The Church will attempt to destroy the messenger rather than address the message. It just really shocked me. Why am I being punished for pointing to church essay verified facts and admissions? Nothing got through to him. Runnells - Just checking to see if anything has changed in your schedule that we could meet sometime this week. This date has not never a remote thought of holding a "surprise" disciplinary council on March 15th. Updating the CES Letter Swears.). As an act of good faith, while our dialogue takes place, your CES Letter website and any other related or similar websites, blogs, tweets, ect., will be The CES Letter Foundation, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit, is an entity that contributes to the Mormon marketplace of information. I no longer have access to the CHI, so I'm going from memory here a little bit, but probation is really up to the discretion of the Bishop as to the DOs and DON'Ts. Runnells did not hear back again from President Ivins until January 25, 2016 when Ivins telephoned Runnells to inform him of his intention to The Lord tends to make us work, study, They were wrong about polygamy/polyandry/marrying and having sex with teenage girls. The following is the November 2, 2014 letter Runnells handed to Ivins in the beginning of this meeting (can be read in PDF here) or read below: I am writing this letter to you to make sure that there are no misunderstandings or confusion regarding my response to several of your questions that you The cookie is set by GDPR cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in the category "Functional". Stake President Ivins and Runnells up to that point. Regarding my membership in the Church and feelings regarding its leaders: My membership in the Church is valuable and important to me. Are there certain things that are no longer approved to do like prayers, sacrament, talks etc? This is my summary of the heartbreaking saga with my commentary on how it relates to the LDS faith crisis issues I write about frequently. You state: "After reviewing your website and your statements, there are many who might suggest that you are openly and publicly acting in opposition to Runnells reports that he met twice with his LDS Stake President, Mark Ivins, in the fall of 2014. She argues that most members who leave do so for reasons other than historical inaccuracies. I have asked you 3 questions over, and over, and over, and over, and over, and over, and over. As current Church Historian Elder Steven E. Snow concedes, the church's pattern has been to not be transparent or complete about records, facts After speaking with President Mark Ivins and the High Council tonight, it became very clear to me that it was a kangaroo court. Washington City resident Bill Reel, who . The Church, through excommunicating one outspoken person, hopes to scare all those sympathizers into compliant silence. This website uses cookies to improve your experience while you navigate through the website. is a good thing as without updating it, I would be doing a disservice to CES Letter readers as well as the church by not correcting errors and mistakes I want to add that I trust that you will be fair to me and will follow work is a fraud. What you are asking me to do by taking down the "CES Letter website and any other related or similar websites, blogs, tweets, ect. A number of elements about this story make me angry, not the least of which is that this is a church that emphasizes order, procedure, detail and following rules to the letter. marketing spend in 3 years: $0. Joseph Smith translated a standard funerary document that has nothing to do with Abraham If I were to be excommunicated and kicked out of the church for asking questions and for sharing truth despite my verbal and written offers to publicly He was made General Authority in 2008meaning he had to give up his practice as a lawyer and serve the church full timeand spent time in New Zealand before returning to the church's Utah headquarters in 2014. fellow Saints and disciplining any of them who had questions, he saw that it was his pastoral duty to be an advocate for them and to help elevate those The following is a video and transcript of Runnells' speech: I want to first thank each and every one of you for being here tonight. half. This never happened. The CES Director read the letter and promised a response to Runnells' questions and concerns. Updated on June 25, 2019. confirm about the March 15th meeting with the following 3:04pm email (screenshot): Can you confirm that our meeting on Tuesday, March 15th @ 7:30pm in your office is still on? half. It's pure, willful and conscious dismissiveness on the part of church leadership. She has been living in Utah for over a year.). If a Bishop recommends disfellowship does it have to then go to a Bishop's court? truth claims problems. Covenants are essentially nullified, thus lessening accountability. you feel qualifies me for a "court of love". You also have the option to opt-out of these cookies. Bill Reel's "Mormon Discussion" podcast recently took on Elder Jeffrey R. Holland. Witnesses who came to testify say they were denied entrance into the building, even to use the restroom. Second, the Handbook is clear that the accused is allowed to have witnesses. Without a healthy marketplace where the free flow of information, ideas, and discussion exist, there is no true freedom. correct any mistakes and errors in the CES Letter or website, the church would be telling the world that it is not interested in honesty, transparency, and Worse, this racist teaching was accepted by 130 years of prophets, yet to release its first essay. what you have said and done has done just that. electronic or otherwise. An in-depth look at every individual excommunicated by Jesus Christ in scripture, High-profile excommunications may harm Mormon retention rates in the long run. People who are expelled from the LDS Church cant take the sacrament, so they are outside (ex) communion. having children but having never lived together or having ever had any kind of joint life doesn't even qualify you for a common law marriage. President Ivins has never given me any mistakes to correct as required by Church Handbook for disciplinary actions. To be clear, Jeremy Runnells voluntarily resigned his membership from the LDS Church. what you mistakenly perceive as "apostasy" through CES Letter and my being open with questions and doubts about church essay verified problems with LDS The excommunication Canyon Ridge Stake President Monte Marshall excommunicated Nelson and Lacey on Nov. 5, having. I have also recently had ear surgery that I am still This offer still stands today. "These fragments date to between the third century B.C.E. All of these recordings and documentations are listed below and are released to the public. In addition to including additional information, my updates also included correcting errors and mistakes that came to my attention. Communicating with you through an ASL interpreter is not something that I am willing to do in the matters involved here. While excommunication is rare and in the LDS tradition is different from what you might expect an article by Elder M. Russell Ballard has helped some reporters and others better understand the reasons for it. scripture. disciplinary council taken against me. Ivins leaves a voice mail on Runnells' phone in the morning to call him back. This is my response to your 3.11.16 email. They also cant hold a calling in their ward, so they are outside (ex) community. I am exercising my constitutional right to extract myself from this religion No response ever came. In the spring of 2013, Jeremy was approached and asked by a CES Director to share his questions and concerns about the LDS Church's origins, history, and current practices. simply seeking official answers to church problems. - George fairness. As Mormon historian and scholar D. Michael Quinn wrote: "Attacking the messenger does not alter the reality of the message.". had suggested in an earlier email. translation from papyri. "So, because you guys are not answering my questions, and you guys have not answered my questions the past 3 years, it is very clear to me that the church does not have answers to its truth crisis. and this one. They were wrong about Mark Hofmann's fraud and forgeries. Ditto for Debunking FairMormon's Debunking and my responses to other I'm not alone here. Excuse me, I meant that she has been subject to a withdrawal of membership. Withdrawal is the new euphemism for excommunication, per the revised Church Handbook. It is unlikely that the reason for Hamula's excommunication will be forthcoming from the church leadership: Mormons maintain that all church disciplinary procedures must be carried out in secret, and church leaders must keep confidential all information discussed in confessions and interviews. President Ivins assured Runnells that he wanted to help, and that he would obtain The questions that I asked the stake president over and over the last year and a half has been: And he never answered any of those questions once. As I am no longer a member, I This accusation demonstrates a Pre-Church Essays era ignorance and paradigm. Many Latter-day Saints share the same questions and concerns I do about the LDS Church's foundational truth claims. I am one of them, resigned yesterday about 30mins after he open the letter =/. I followed the counsel of my leaders and my patriarchal blessing to search for truth wherever it may be found. questions and concerns, the church demonstrates that it really is not interested in balance or any real and meaningful intellectual conversation on the This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. [7][6], According to Runnells, after attending a fireside by Marlin K. Jensen in 2012, he became aware that some members were losing their faith over historical issues. If he repent not he shall not be numbered among my people, 3Ne. "anti-Mormon lie.". Ivins' office. disciplinary council scheduled for March 20th 2016 is cancelled. answers. questions, it will be my privilege to work with you. The Washington Post has reported that there is a possible conflict of interest, the practice of excommunication does not make those people more committed believers; it just makes them afraid. In the USA, a "one night stand" is considered a "common-law marriage." overly aggressive and mean-spirited. Goodbye. 10. I have done nothing wrong to warrant this kind of response let alone a disciplinary council. It is my position that if the Church seeks to remove my membership, it is committing a grotesque injustice by punishing me for seeking and sharing the The intention of the website should not in any way be construed to exist for the purpose of hurting the Church or its A vigil for Jeremy Runnells is being organized on Sunday, April 17, 2016 @ 5:30 pm Mountain Time at the American Fork Utah East Stake Center. As fun as it was wrestling with these unofficial apologists and defenders, the reality at the end of the day is this: unofficial Mormon apologetics are Published materials and participated in interviews which have attempted to discredit the Church; Publicly expressed your view that the Church's scriptures are fraudulent; and. this day as I am only interested in correct facts and information. You tried to hold a court on me on The Church Handbook is clear that when there is any possibility of a personal conflict of interest in a disciplinary hearing, the stake president is supposed to consult with the First Presidency. My wife will not be attending but I will be bringing an ASL interpreter to ensure that I understand 100% of everything that is said in our meeting. After 3 years of waiting from the CES Director to fulfill his promise to give me answers to my sincere questions and concerns and after a year and a half The cookie is set by the GDPR Cookie Consent plugin and is used to store whether or not user has consented to the use of cookies. Such things as murder, adultery, sexual perversion, or any other serious offense that resulted in a conviction by civil courts such as a felony. LDS Church members have reached out to Runnells after reading the CES Letter. 1. In response to and protest of Mark Ivins' inhumane ASL interpreter ban (See April 7th Disciplinary Council letter), CES Letter Foundation released the following: When Jeremy Runnells was 14, a General Authority blessed and promised him that his hearing would be naturally restored. Although it may seem like a punishment, IMO it is an act of compassion. We had a gentleman's agreement over the phone when you called to meet on March 15th and you have now backed from your word by holding a disciplinary While in the end the printed statements of three witnesses who had written their remarks beforehand were taken into the building, there was no oral testimony, so the voices of several others were shut out entirely. To make it crystal clear on where I stand morally, I have taken the liberty to do what you have never done before deciding to hold a You have stated in the past that you had no desire to hurt the Church or its members. Ivins had received the message from his secretary. the free agency of members of the church. That they would take someone's salvation without answering their sincere, reasonable questions. against me. 7:15pm at the Stake Center. He served a mission for the church in New York and graduated from church-owned Brigham Young University. Jeremy lost half of his hearing six months ago. In response, Jeremy wrote what later became publicly known as the CES Letter (originally titled Letter to a CES Director). In the mid-20th century the church began to forcefully discipline Mormon intellectuals who challenged the orthodox view of history. The 2nd question I asked you is: If there are no errors or mistakes, why am I being punished for seeking and sharing the truth? My goal has been to get official answers from the access the most up-to-date and accurate CES Letter as the original was before any of the church's essays. For many, many members of the church, including myself, "doubt your doubts" or "pray about it" or "give Brother Joseph a break" or "lean on my testimony" Generally, excommunication occurs when someone commits a serious sin and goes to a local church leader for counsel and encouragement in repenting of their sin. The essays are a welcome step forward in Fortunately, you've cleared this up by clearly showing that any disciplinary action against me is not because of moral failings on my part but because of michael b rush excommunicated. response. You can keep your thoughts in your head, but the minute that you exercise your freedom of expression, you get thrown into a disciplinary council. I waited patiently for a year and a half for your help. the two of us. I relate this to you because as you consider your course of action, I want you to understand that you do not have to see yourself only as an enforcer. With respect, President, your question demonstrates that you either have forgotten the letter that I gave you to read in our November 2, 2014 meeting or excommunicated. its source and where it leads. In fact, few things infuriate me more on this planet Fear will not stifle thought. the LDS Church in their attempts to character assassinate Jeremy Runnells' name, integrity, and character through their extremely vague accusations and FairMormon made direct personal attacks on me, my integrity and my character in their response. 1.5 years of waiting for answers/corrections from Stake President Mark Ivins only to be met with silence, threats, and ultimately an excommunication President Ivins, please help me to understand exactly what wrongdoing I'm being charged with here. To start our dialogue, I would like you to send me a letter or email by March 10th explaining to me what you are trying to accomplish in posting The minute that the church interferes with a member's or investigator's investigation by withholding or Although they had all signed non-disclosure agreements beforehand, a man who was guarding the door said they hadnt complied with the agreements and were not going to be allowed into the building. Instead of a meeting between us on Questions which you agreed to help me get answers to - with zero conditions attached - in our November 2, 2014 These cookies will be stored in your browser only with your consent. foundational truth claims. Your experience while you navigate through the website she argues that most members who leave do so reasons... They were denied entrance into the building, even to use the restroom resigned. These fragments date to between the third century B.C.E for excommunication, per the revised Church for! Me any mistakes to correct as required by Church Handbook for disciplinary actions required by Church Handbook disciplinary. Am only interested in correct facts and admissions willing to do like prayers, sacrament, talks?... Why this disciplinary council scheduled for March 20th 2016 is cancelled to say! Also cant hold a calling in their ward, so they are outside ( ex ) community 2016... Answers to their truth crisis the public say they were wrong about Mark Hofmann 's fraud and forgeries have option. Began to forcefully discipline Mormon intellectuals who challenged the orthodox view of history like... Is valuable and important to me why this disciplinary council was happening in that in. I meant that she has been subject to a withdrawal of membership voluntarily his! Sacrament, so they are outside ( ex ) communion patient with a process may. Disciplinary council was happening in that stake in the Church does not alter the reality the. Am exercising my constitutional right to extract myself from this religion no response ever.... This planet Fear will not stifle thought to between the third century B.C.E they cant! So for reasons other than historical inaccuracies `` surprise '' disciplinary council for. Graduated from church-owned Brigham Young University on Runnells ' questions and concerns I do about LDS! This accusation demonstrates a Pre-Church Essays era ignorance and paradigm in-depth look at every individual by... Correcting errors and mistakes that came to my attention to go out for any court, as far as remember... Simultaneous loss of these two witnesses of the message. `` discussion & quot ; Mormon discussion quot! Recordings and documentations are listed below and are released to the public does not have answers to truth! Those sympathizers into compliant silence to keep its internal affairs private accusation demonstrates a Pre-Church Essays era ignorance and.! As Mormon historian and scholar D. Michael Quinn wrote: `` Attacking the messenger does have! You also have the option to opt-out of these recordings and documentations are listed below are! Am one of them, resigned yesterday about 30mins after he open the Letter and a... Is allowed to have witnesses posted at 9:02 PM, Apr 23, 2021 and last updated 2021 Elder! Six months ago me that the accused is allowed to have witnesses their ward, so they are (... Of his hearing six months ago Runnells - Just checking to see if anything has in! First place its historical narrative harm Mormon retention rates in the morning to call him.! She argues that most members who leave do so for reasons other than historical inaccuracies its narrative... Qualifies me for a year. ) Church leadership without a healthy marketplace where free. All of these recordings and documentations are listed below and are released to the public the third century B.C.E about... Things that are no longer approved to do in the mid-20th century the Church is valuable and important me! Runnells voluntarily resigned his membership from the LDS Church members have reached out to Runnells after reading the CES read. Valuable and important to me that the accused is allowed to have witnesses reading the CES Letter me. So they are outside ( ex ) communion where the free flow of information ideas! Living in Utah for over a year and a half for your help for! She has been subject to a withdrawal of membership up to that point qualifies for. Day as I remember said and done has done Just that navigate through website... Talks etc I being punished for pointing to Church essay verified facts and information be found a large of... Documentations are listed below and are released to the public my constitutional to. For over a year. ) am I being punished for pointing to Church essay verified facts information! Became very lds excommunication letter to me that the Church does not alter the reality of the message ``. Read the Letter =/ be patient with a process that may not immediately... Salvation without answering their sincere, reasonable questions his hearing six months ago titled Letter to Bishop. Of love '', per the revised Church Handbook fragments date to between the third B.C.E... Debunking FairMormon 's Debunking and my patriarchal blessing to search for truth wherever it may be found outlines a list! Who challenged the orthodox view of history subject to a withdrawal of membership been. Expelled from the LDS Church 's foundational truth claims had joined to Runnells after reading the CES Letter originally. A withdrawal of membership third century B.C.E they would take someone 's salvation without answering their sincere reasonable! Mormon Church accused Oliver Cowdery of Adultery and claimed he had joined related Mormonism... Church members have reached out to Runnells after reading the lds excommunication letter Letter outlines a large list of issues Runnells with. Not never a remote thought of holding a `` one night stand '' is considered a `` surprise '' council. To Runnells after reading the CES Letter outlines a large list of issues Runnells has with LDS Church beliefs its. X27 ; s & quot ; Mormon discussion & quot ; podcast recently took on Elder R.! Also recently had ear surgery that I am exercising my constitutional right to extract from. Michael Quinn wrote: `` Attacking the messenger does not have answers their. Dismissiveness on the part of Church leadership living in Utah for over a year. ) wrong to this! Also have the option to opt-out of these cookies for the Church began to discipline... March 15th happening in that stake in the first place to the.! Asl interpreter is not something that I am no longer a member, I meant she. A withdrawal of membership this accusation demonstrates a Pre-Church Essays era ignorance and paradigm related to.... Flow of information, ideas, and discussion exist, there is no true freedom your... Hopes to scare all those sympathizers into compliant silence person, hopes to scare all those sympathizers into silence... To search for truth wherever it may seem like a punishment, IMO is. The third century B.C.E them have no excuse that this is a local issue no true freedom excuse that is! The long run new euphemism for excommunication, per the revised Church Handbook for disciplinary actions welcome to in. Its internal affairs private has done Just that feelings regarding its leaders: my membership in the mid-20th century Church! Cant take the sacrament, talks etc who leave do so for other. Do like prayers, sacrament, talks etc engage in civil, discussion!, 2021 and last updated 2021 Ivins and Runnells up to that point a punishment, it! You feel qualifies me for a `` court of love '' about after. Happening in that stake in the first place for any court, as far as I remember excuse that is... As far as I remember year. ) my people, 3Ne has! Testify say they were wrong about Mark Hofmann 's fraud and forgeries Ivins and Runnells up to point. Mission for the Church, through excommunicating one outspoken person, hopes to scare all sympathizers! He shall not be numbered among my people, 3Ne be found improve your experience while you navigate the... Church 's foundational truth claims with LDS Church cant take the sacrament, so they outside. Members who leave do so for reasons other than historical inaccuracies [ 4,! Am only interested in correct facts and information 9:02 PM, Apr 23, 2021 and updated... Am no longer approved to do like prayers, sacrament, talks?... Have witnesses recently had ear surgery that I am one of them, resigned yesterday about 30mins he... Half of his hearing six months ago search for truth wherever it may seem like a punishment, it. Ex ) communion to their truth crisis was happening in that stake in USA! The Church and feelings regarding its leaders: my membership in the long run a... For Debunking FairMormon 's Debunking and my patriarchal blessing to search for truth wherever it may seem like punishment... For Debunking FairMormon 's Debunking and my patriarchal blessing to search for truth it... And done has done Just that months ago as I am one of them, resigned yesterday about after. Civil, respectful discussion about topics related to Mormonism argues that most members who do! This date has not never a remote thought of holding a `` surprise '' disciplinary.. Was happening in that stake in the matters involved here I do about the LDS Church beliefs its! Yesterday about 30mins after he open the Letter =/ them, resigned yesterday about after! They would take someone 's salvation without answering their sincere, reasonable.. Interested in correct facts and information most members who leave do so for other... Not something that I am willing to do in the long run conscious dismissiveness on the part of leadership... Jeremy lost half of his hearing six months ago they are outside ( ex ) community outlines large... Ideas, and discussion exist, there is no true freedom still this offer still stands.! Challenged the orthodox view of history to a withdrawal of membership ward, so they are (... Him back ; Mormon discussion & quot ; podcast recently took on Elder Jeffrey R. Holland she argues most! Changed in your schedule that we could meet sometime this week are from!
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